The Uk Guardian newspaprer has broken the story of just how much the US gov't tracks its nation's phone calls. One chilling aspect for non US residents is the justification that " we only spy on foreigners" i.e its Ok to trawl the emails ,and cyber chats of everybody outside the USA who has to use a US based site - like this one.
So, whether in US or not how do people feel about all this stuff on here being watched by the US government?
As a thought it might be unwise to write any CF stories about female middle eastern terrorists as some people have done - could trigger a deeper search of your internet life!
I'm surprised that you all feint to discover this. I have read some years ago that the USA, with the complicity of England, developped a program called Echelon. The purpose was to spy all e-mails and phone conversations...in Europe. That was at the beginning of this century or at the end of the previous one, I'm not quite sure.
But I remember during a few days I ended most of my conversations by some insults directed to the USA :D just in case they would read or hear it ;D
The CIA never arrested me though ;D
So now they spy your own conversations. Another example of the paranoia which reigns there...
The contents of this site are NOT a secret only registered members know?? OMG, I'm shocked!! LOL
Quote from: herboyfriend on June 08, 2013, 11:58:21 AM
Your real name, address and possible Facebook connections are NOT a secret?? OMG, I'm shocked!! LOL
Here, I fixed this.
Weapons of Ass Destruction, more like.
Quote from: tomboy999999 on June 08, 2013, 10:21:55 AM
The Uk Guardian newspaprer has broken the story of just how much the US gov't tracks its nation's phone calls. One chilling aspect for non US residents is the justification that " we only spy on foreigners" i.e its Ok to trawl the emails ,and cyber chats of everybody outside the USA who has to use a US based site - like this one.
So, whether in US or not how do people feel about all this stuff on here being watched by the US government?
As a thought it might be unwise to write any CF stories about female middle eastern terrorists as some people have done - could trigger a deeper search of your internet life!
Well first off this is
NOT a US based site. Also most if not all governments are doing the same thing. If you think the USA is the only country doing it your very naive.
I am sure more than the US governemnt does it but few governments have their resources.
Where is this site based then, if not US?
The ownership is UK based and the servers I believe are the Netherlands. But it certainly is not US based. Even so I fail to see what people are excited over. The sheer volume of data alone means one would likely have to meet several criteria before even being flagged for so much as a second look. Writing about middle eastern women is unlikely to merit anything. Writing something that has intimate details about a terrorist group may get you flagged. But then if you post that in public anyways and happen to be in such a group..well you might be too dumb for that sort of work :)
And for those who obsess over someone tracking what they view, again the sheer volume means its unlike YOUR data with get special treatment. To paraphrase Stalin "One catfight fan is a pervert, a million is a statistic. "
Now I am sure someone will go "Meg that's all well and good but my 500 posts on Stormfront, emails to white power leaders and request for bomb plans and synagogue layouts are ENTIRELY innocent. And some govt tracking will make me look like some sort of bad guy, darn it" Point taken but that's a chance you have to take ;)
Yes the servers are in the Netherlands.... Well ya know weather you think about it or not your watched all the time. Go to an ATM machine or Walmart or the local mall every store has cameras. Hell in some states they use cameras to give drivers tickets for running traffic lights. Most big cities have cameras on the streets. The town I live in has cameras in the park.
Every site you visit tracks what site or search engine you came from. Hell even facebook tracks your every movement online. Thats what all those likes are you see as you surf. They are targeted to what you like on facebook. In other words they are following all over the internet and targeting adds and articles to you. Law enforcement agencies even use facebook and other social media sites to search for people with warrants that have fled. Search engines like Google and Bing save all your searches for a year or two and will turn that info over to any government that wants it. So don't think when your search for cat fight or porn sites that it isn't saved. But i really don't think any government is interested in yours or my surfing to fetish sites. And neither do i think they are interested in my emails or yahoo conversations. Also as long as your not doing anything illegal you have nothing to worry about.
It has its good and bad POINTS butt all in all in two words sums it UP.. FUCK THEM read this....http://news.yahoo.com/since-9-11-life-surveillance-made-easier-150108779.html
QuoteAlso as long as your not doing anything illegal you have nothing to worry about.
Not until some religious extremist leader declares this kind of fetish is pervers and so illegal. Don't try to have this kind of website in some muslim countries. And I believe some christians fanatics might do the same. Fortunately they didn't conquer power yet...but it is a threat and the day they come to power, they will have the tools to repress what they see as out of their moral behaviour.
Quote from: Gaelle on June 09, 2013, 11:31:34 AM
QuoteAlso as long as your not doing anything illegal you have nothing to worry about.
Not until some religious extremist leader declares this kind of fetish is pervers and so illegal. Don't try to have this kind of website in some muslim countries. And I believe some christians fanatics might do the same. Fortunately they didn't conquer power yet...but it is a threat and the day they come to power, they will have the tools to repress what they see as out of their moral behaviour.
Thanks. I had been looking for an example of how the left wing can be as shrill and base don generating fear and hatred in the masses as the right wing.
What next, should I worry about my meat based recipes for when the inevitable rise of a vegan to power arrives?
Quote from: fightfanatic on June 09, 2013, 12:09:29 PM
Quote from: nutmeg78 on June 09, 2013, 11:57:02 AM
Quote from: Gaelle on June 09, 2013, 11:31:34 AM
QuoteAlso as long as your not doing anything illegal you have nothing to worry about.
Not until some religious extremist leader declares this kind of fetish is pervers and so illegal. Don't try to have this kind of website in some muslim countries. And I believe some christians fanatics might do the same. Fortunately they didn't conquer power yet...but it is a threat and the day they come to power, they will have the tools to repress what they see as out of their moral behaviour.
Thanks. I had been looking for an example of how the left wing can be as shrill and base don generating fear and hatred in the masses as the right wing.
What next, should I worry about my meat based recipes for when the inevitable rise of a vegan to power arrives?
It's not so much an issue of worrying per se, as it is just being aware of what the government is capable of doing if left unchallenged. What they do may not effect some of us now but it does not mean it couldn't in the future. There is a long long history of abuse of power by the state in one form or another. If coming down on something or someone can somehow suit their interests in any way, they will not hesitate to do so. They do not discriminate.
Evils like the Emancipation Proclamation and desegregation, both enforced by armed force. :) Hell your argument is pretty much why many of those radical Christians you fear also fear legalized gay marriage since it is a sign the government is coming to take God away. Fear mongering goes both ways. This is EXACTLY the same arguments the right wing uses when the government does something they don't like. All we need is for someone to toss in the phrase "slippery slope"
Everyone loves the government when it does something they support, no matter how heavy handed it is. Everyone fears it when it so much as ponders doing something they don't. And really the examples of the government hating catfighting, they don't need to track your information they would just do a google search and shut the websites they could down.
What it comes down to is this: I would prefer someone be against invasions of privacy for law enforcement because they honestly believe it is not useful for the pursuit of said law enforcement. At least that is an informed decision by someone aware of the risks.
If its based on "no don't take my freedom away for any reason ! " , fine but you should stand by your convictions in good and bad. Namely should any terrorist act occur that could have been prevented by said freedoms being infringed upon, no bitching. Should a major US city be destroyed by a WMD, you will be fine with that to preserve your freedom. Freedoms and security involve tradeoffs. At least have some inkling of that fact.
Thre quotes come to mind
" You may trust this government with your private data and on line thoughts - do you trust any future government as well"
" Nothing to fear if you are law abidng" - yes, but who's laws and if the courts supervising them are secret how will you know?
A US officer after the battle of Hue in the Vietnam war " to save Hue we had to destroy it"
I really do not care what the government tracks. If they think my porn is interesting, they're welcome to it
Well, this thread is really interesting. And more interesting for me as an European, to see how Americans react about a subject like this;
We heard about the Patrioct Act after 9/11. I remember at that time, many people here said.."ok..the Americans were crazy before this, now they are completely nuts". I think we didn't clearly realize the trauma Americans suffered by that agression - I have really a problem to use the term "terrorist act" as I'm convinced it was an act of war more than anything else-
It is true that Europe suffered terrorism during decades plus more wars than Americans will even never see and when we saw the reaction after 9/11, our first thought was "hey! if we should react like that after every attack, we would be a gigantic concentration camp".
Quote""In Germany they came first for the Communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time no one was left to speak up."
I was thinking at the same sentence while reading this thread.
I don't think "the government" is to blame or to fear. A government is an abstraction; It is an institution. i fear more those who belong to the government..and those who are behind.
In Germany, between the two world wars, they had many different governments - right and left - until Hitler went to power. The policy changed drastically with Hitler. it was not "the government" who suddenly became evil..it was the leader and the men who were into the government who were completely insane.
The same appeared in Italy before Mussolini...or in Iran before the Islamic revolution.
In the USA - and I fear it slowly becomes the same in Europe - the "government" is even not the major power in the country. The politicians are clearly the puppets of a few big bosses, financials and industrials from whom they get the money needed to be elected. Those people are behind and those are the real "government".
So when a decision such as spying the population or reducing the liberties is taken, the true question is : who will make a profit with it?
Find the answer is finding who inspired it.
The left wing has spoken ;)
I don't like it that big brother can watch us anywhere but if they wanna watch me and my girl on tis site I will be first to give them my computer me and my girl don't have anything to hide. she has my password on here and is interested in this type stuff and its our thing. maybe the govt has a female that is into this and that's why they want to track us..
Big deal. Means more views for my stories....
;D
Quote from: Judy D on June 08, 2013, 12:07:42 PM
I AM AN UNDERCOVER CIA AGENT. WHOOPS. :D
Call me naive, but I had no idea you could put words into other peoples mouths like that here at the forum.
To be honest, that worries me more than the possibility of being spied on by the CIA or MI5, at least while I'm here. I mean, do they really care what I'm getting up to in Catfightland?
Out there in The Real World though, I think it is a cause for concern. We may be paranoid, but that doesn't mean they aren't after us.
I hate the fact that ALL governments monitor internet activities.
Friends around the world, please don't blame me.
I voted for Ron Paul. ;D One of my favorite people in the world is Judge Andrew Napolitano. Another great writer you might not be aware of on these matters is Kane of the WWE.
If you know their values, you easily know mine.
How do you know the government is lying to you ---- Their lips are moving -- ba bump bump --- can care less about the government , they do their thing & I do mine , I am a bonafide law abiding citizen & one of the good guys on this earth , doing my taxes , you want to contribute to the re-election fund ? -- NOOOOOOOOOOOO -- they do what they do & if they are going spy on us , at least they can find a way to contribute to the site , have their secretaries wrestle for us or something ;D
Quotethe politicians STILL do not seem to grasp that Human being DO NOT & WILL NOT suffer ANY form or level of tyranny for any length of time, ESPECIALLY when we have been accustomed to some level of Freedom of thought, speech and/or behaviour.
I recently watched a tv show about the raising of Hitler and I learned something I didn't know..but which, thinking about it, is not surprising...in the 30's, Hitler praised the USA for having the best system of the world. He was referring at the tyranny the Black people suffered there and the American apartheid system inspired him - among many other influences - for his criminal policy about the Jews.
Germany, Italy and Spain knew democracy before falling into the fascist trap. Iran had a kind of democracy before voting for the islamic dictature; look at Turkey today. It is a laïc state which is in danger to fall into a muslim dictature too. Lybia and Tunisia fought against a 30 years dictature just to fall into the hands of muslims extremists.
in Belgium, we suffered two occupations last century and still 30% of the Flemish people vote for fascists and nationalist parties. Same in France where 15% of the people vote for extreme right...Should I give more examples?
i'm not sure your affirmation is correct..sadly.